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#1
AviK

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Hello,
In our company, FH was alwyas the only program for Map Publishing. since Macromedia stopped the development the natural alternative was Illy CS. the only problem that even our strongest Mac (G5) has dificulty handeling large area files containg thousands of points and hebrew texts which makes me to think it is not a possible solution. Does anyone else has the same problem? can a new fast Mac Pro with CS2 speed up the work speed? or should we devide our files to smaller ones? or I just should suffer slowly...Help! my boss needs me to find a solution.
Thank you all

#2
Rick Dey

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Each new release of Illustrator adds great new features for the graphic artists but unfortunately for those of us making maps, it tends to add a lot of bloat that is useless to us. Granted some of those features are valuable and allow Avenza to add more capabilities but mostly they just slow down the program. Another consideration is that as cartographers we tend to push the limits of Illustrator's type capabilities. Just speak with an Adobe rep and watch his eyes roll back into his head when you mention having 10,000+ pieces of type in a document. As far as a new Mac Pro helping, you'll see little improvement in speed until CS3 since it will run in Rosetta. But then who knows what great new features will slow us down even more in the new release. Sometimes I'd like to consider what it would be like to run Illustrator 5.5 on these new machines, but there are some features I'd be loath to give back.

The only recommendations I can give you are, lots of memory, keep as many layers turned off as possible when saving (especially type), keep PDF compatability off untill you actually need it (maybe at the end of a project when/if exporting to other programs) and keeping any of your placed raster images in PSD or TIF formats.
Rick Dey

#3
Hans van der Maarel

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In short... suffer is the right word. Dividing a map into smaller portions is an idea, but has its drawbacks (if you have texts that run across that border, you have to make sure they look good once it's all put together...).

Right now with the mapping that I do I'm not running into the limitations yet, but I've had it happen with clients and they were not happy with that. The only thing I can recommend is keeping the file as clean as possible.


Another consideration is that as cartographers we tend to push the limits of Illustrator's type capabilities. Just speak with an Adobe rep and watch his eyes roll back into his head when you mention having 10,000+ pieces of type in a document.


Did they ever come up with a solution for the type incompatabilities? Just asking because I'm about to start work on updating a map from Illy 10 to CS2 and I've estimated about 10-15 hours of redoing type...
Hans van der Maarel - Cartotalk Editor
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#4
ELeFevre

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Working with really large maps in Illustrator and MaPublisher can be problematic, especially as the project nears completion and the file size grows. In addition to turning off PDF option, you should also remove any un-necessary columns from your attribute data. I usually open the .shp file (or whatever) in a seperate Illustrator document first and clean out all unnecessary data. Or you could do this in your GIS. This is also a good time to simplify and concatanate the paths. After I have cleaned and trimmed down the data, I import the layer into my main project.

It's also a good idea to use low-resolution place holder images until you are ready to print. You should also look into getting a seperate drive to use as your scratch disk. Oh, and remove all symbols that are not being used (you can export these as a library so you still have them). Symbols seem to take tons of system resources.



#5
frax

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if you feel that FH works for you (with special needs) , and has the features you need - I would continue using it. At least for the time being.
Hugo Ahlenius
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#6
Rick Dey

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Hans,

As far as the conversion of type from 10 to CS is concerned, there are some improvements in CS2 but nothing is complete. If you decide to convert the type, then the path type gets screwed up but the non path offsets are ok. If you leave it unchanged to convert later, path type will be OK but any baseline offsets will be lost in non-path type .

The only approach that works for now is convert all type to outline in 10 before migrating the file over leaving the type uneditable but then you can mess with it as you need to edit it later. The big problem is that when working in CS you have to change the baseline location in order to get type to track properly.
Rick Dey

#7
Hans van der Maarel

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Rick,

I noticed during some testing that if you have type that is royally screwed up in CS2 (only showing the little red plus sign in a square), it sometimes pop back if you change the font size (e.g. from 6 pt to 5.9 pt). Changing it back to what it was supposed to be then makes the text disappear again... :blink:
Hans van der Maarel - Cartotalk Editor
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#8
Derek Tonn

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I reluctantly bought a copy of AI CS2 today.....mainly as a "band-aid" to try and improve the process of getting our Corel Draw work on a PC into our clients hands in Illustrator on a Mac. Corel Draw and Freehand are superior map design applications to AI, in my own humble opinion. However, most of the "real world" in the design community owns a copy of the AI CS2 suite (for Photoshop and InDesign, more than anything), so the rest of us are stuck having to humor folks by converting our output into something that Illustrator can understand. :)

Did I mention my 10+ hour trip to **** and back today when trying to get the software I just paid for to download off of Adobe.com? Argh. I'm feeling a bit "punchy" tonight, so I apologize to any Illustrator fans in the house. I'm just not too happy about having to spend $370 for a copy of that program....when myself and most of my designers are perfectly happy and well-served using Corel and Freehand......

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#9
ELeFevre

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Hans,
The red + sign (over-flow symbol) indicates that the text is larger than the text box. Reducing the font size will typically make the text magically appear! You can also resize the text box and achieve the same results. E



#10
benbakelaar

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I'm just not too happy about having to spend $370 for a copy of that program....when myself and most of my designers are perfectly happy and well-served using Corel and Freehand......

Derek

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Derek, you are so honorable. BitTorrent abounds with copies for 'testing' purposes. ;) Also, always keep a few friends in college... doesn't Adobe offer a student discount?

#11
GISRox

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Derek, you are so honorable. BitTorrent abounds with copies for 'testing' purposes. ;) Also, always keep a few friends in college... doesn't Adobe offer a student discount?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Let me get on my soapbox for a moment. I've been a software developer, for over 10 years, developing mapping and geology software. From my perspective, I find it very disheartening to read posts of this nature. I don't understand the philosophy of not purchasing software that you can and will use to produce a map product for profit. So many people *chuckle* and say I'm only using it for testing purposes, yet continue to use the software for years and years. I hope that people will consider the ramifications of software theft and how it does impact those who spend years developing those products? If you don't want to pay for a product, don't use it.



#12
benbakelaar

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Let me get on my soapbox for a moment. 


Well, I should amend my statement. For the record, my day job is in IT, and the software I use to make money off of maps (ArcGIS, Paint Shop Pro) I have paid for. My philosophy is that, if you use the program daily, to make profit, then yes you should pay for it. So that does apply to Derek, and obviously Derek agrees with you since he went out and purchased it :)

But for explorers, experimenters, testers, lurkers, the irregular user, or someone who needs to accomplish a task only once (for whatever reason), highly-priced software presents a barrier.

#13
jerseysbest

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Rick,

I noticed during some testing that if you have type that is royally screwed up in CS2 (only showing the little red plus sign in a square), it sometimes pop back if you change the font size (e.g. from 6 pt to 5.9 pt). Changing it back to what it was supposed to be then makes the text disappear again...  :blink:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>



That means the text you have is bigger than the text box you created. I usually only make a text box when I have to constrain text to a specific area. Alteratively you can just click once (not dragging) and have the cursor appear.

#14
jonathanelevy

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Hey Avi,
I have a MacBookPro (the laptop) and it does not handle CS2 and large map files well. Wish it did though!!!

#15
GISRox

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But for explorers, experimenters, testers, lurkers, the irregular user, or someone who needs to accomplish a task only once (for whatever reason), highly-priced software presents a barrier.


Perhaps. With a plethora or free or inexpensive software available, I don't really see this as a barrier. We can't always drive a Ferrari to get the groceries. B)






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