18 replies to this topic

[Jason]

I
have had two map sets printed on PolyArt. I have no experience with
Hop-Syn but I do like that it can be recycled, the printer I used said
that PolyArt cannot be recycled and there is a lot of waste with offset
printing. I like the printing quality but the colors do turn out
slightly different than any proof I've seen, just be aware colors are
not as saturated.
PolyArt says their paper is water-resistant. We
soaked it for several hours and it dried nicely with no adverse effect
on the ink, but it does take on water. With enough force PolyArt can be
torn but under normal wear it holds up nicely.
My complaint with
PolyArt is the folding and the wear on the folds. The mechanical
folding machines don't make a nice crisp fold, but hand folding works
ok, I think it is the amount of pressure, but when you have several
hundred or several thousand printed hand folding is out of the
question. The fold I would say are pretty permanent. My biggest
complaint with the folding is over time and wear the inks don't hold up
on the folds, not cool, but it is better than a paper map.
When
looking for a printer make sure they use the right inks, not the same
at with paper, they are permanent inks. Also at press check keep an
eye, and mention to the operator, the registration. Since it is plastic
it likes to stick to each other but also likes to move in the press
static I believe is the cause. If at all possible try to find a printer
that has experience with synthetic paper, you will be much happier with
the end result. You may also want to look into Yupo paper, it was my
second choose, the printer liked PolyArt better, but I will seriously
consider Yupo next time.

[Matthew Hampton]

"I
would suggest that whatever paper you choose (I've been happy with
Polyart - but it doesn't hold color as good as paper) have the printer
contact the paper manufacturer for specs on inks, drying time,
coatings, etc.

Like Jason mentioned, there are also some
adjustments that can be made at the bindery with respect to folding. I
did an 8-panel tri-fold [url="http://"http://www.metro-region.org/article.cfm?articleid=218"]bike map[/url]
on PolyArt and after looking at the bindery-proof, the folding pressure
was increased b/c the initial folds poofed-out a little bit near the
crease and the map didn't quite have the right mechandising appeal.

What are recommendations for dealing with a printer who hasn't printed on either synthetic paper?

I would either find another printer who does have experience or be
prepared to spend a lot of time proofing at the press and bindery.

"

[Martin Gamache]

If
you contact the local Poly Art distributor they will be able to
recommend printers in your area that have worked with their product and
probably printers with experience printing maps on it.

[Matthew Hampton]

Another comment about polyart that is a complaint of sorts is that it is not very "stiff." I am sure there is a technical term for this attribute in different types of paper - but I haven't learned it yet.

Due to the fact that polyart is not very stiff, the folded map (on display in a rack) slumps over forward and doesn't look very appealing from a merchandising perspective. Has anyone noticed that with other maps/paper?

[Mike H]

PolyArt, HopSyn, Yupo and Tyvex are the major synthetic papers. Tyvex is rarely anymore used due to its rough texture. PolyArt does tend to slump over in the vertical sales racks - if you have merchandising displays that are on an angle, it will work better. But on vertical displays it can be a real problem. Some feel HopSyn has more 'grain' which allows it to stand up better.

PolyArt is tough stuff, it is very difficult to tear in any direction, whereas HopSyn will tear in one direction, but you have to go out of your way to do so. Both are effectively waterproof - they may hold a little moisture, but they work fine in the field, and will dry out. Both have a nice appearance, almost a semi-matte finish. HopSyn is priced a little bit less, I've never worked with Yupo.

In any case do not trust a printer who doen't have experience with synthetics.

Here's a link to a previous thread:

http://www.cartotalk...x.php?t669.html

and check out the Map Printers in the Resource section.

m.

[Martin Gamache]

In any case do not trust a printer who doen't have experience with synthetics.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is crucial...and not just with the printing part, folding synthetic stock is alot more difficult...

mg

[natcase]

PolyArt, HopSyn, Yupo and Tyvex are the major synthetic papers. Tyvex is rarely anymore used due to its rough texture.

It is also I believe the most expensive option. There is a smooth version of tyvek which I have seen used once (envelopes for the Bloomberg Financial empire), which is lovely and uttely tearproof, but very very dear.

PolyArt does tend to slump over in the vertical sales racks - if you have merchandising displays that are on an angle, it will work better. But on vertical displays it can be a real problem. Some feel HopSyn has more 'grain' which allows it to stand up better.

PolyArt is tough stuff, it is very difficult to tear in any direction, whereas HopSyn will tear in one direction, but you have to go out of your way to do so. Both are effectively waterproof - they may hold a little moisture, but they work fine in the field, and will dry out. Both have a nice appearance, almost a semi-matte finish. HopSyn is priced a little bit less, I've never worked with Yupo.

Re folds: consider a side or "book" fold as the final fold. Even with crisp uncoated paper, this can be a problem, and we've reluctantly gone to mostly using side folds (I like the functional simplicity of accordion-and-flop, but it does tend to look like limp lettuse on the rack). Also consider a heavier weight of paper. We've found especially with synthetics this can make a big difference in rack presentation.

HopSyn has a clay surface, so it absorbs some of the ink into the substrate. This means you cannot scratch the ink off the surface, as you can with PolyArt or Yupo. We have printed with all three (but never Tyvek) and ditto Mike's earlier about going with a printer who knows how to work with your paper. Even working with someone who has limited experience with synthetics can be perilous. I'd say either ask the paper company rep for references (at least some paper companies will provide), or look at other people's projects that came out well and follow that lead.

And add an extra few days to your printing schedule to account for drying time between print sides, bindery mixups, etc etc...

[scooper]

Have you ever looked at V-Max? http://www.valeron.com/printing.html V-Max is non-smearing, water resistant and capable of exposure to sub-zero temperatures. V-Max resists tearing but is easily die cut, and because it is not mineral-filled, does not fray like other synthetic products. Easily convertible, V-Max can be perforated, stapled and sewn with good results. It is a good alternative to other synthetics for maps as well. There are options for thicker V-Max to avoid slumping.

[Teri]

HopSyn has an advantage over Polyart in the foldability of the substate as well as better ink adhesion. You won't see the ink coming off in the folds like you do when printing on Polyart because the ink anchors into the substrate. You can fold HopSyn without scoring, which makes it easier to work with.

[GreenLabelman]

HopSyn has an advantage over Polyart in the foldability of the substate as well as better ink adhesion. You won't see the ink coming off in the folds like you do when printing on Polyart because the ink anchors into the substrate. You can fold HopSyn without scoring, which makes it easier to work with.

Try FiberStone® paper made from natural stone. It's waterproof, water-proof, grease proof, tear resistant and tree-free!

[Matthew Hampton]

I thought I would bump this thread and see if anyone has used Fiberstone and can comment on their cartographic production.

Also, I didn't see mention of Teslin along with Yupo, Hop-Syn, Tyvek, or Polyart...

What's your favorite water-resistant, tearproof, recyclable substrate to press ink into?

[David Medeiros]

Are any of these avaialble for laser printing? I have a few recreation maps that I've done and would like to demonstrate them on water proof paper without the cost of of offset printing.

[razornole]

Are any of these avaialble for laser printing? I have a few recreation maps that I've done and would like to demonstrate them on water proof paper without the cost of of offset printing.

I would think that a laser printer would melt the plastic. Could you not use an ink jet?

kru

[David Medeiros]

Are any of these avaialble for laser printing? I have a few recreation maps that I've done and would like to demonstrate them on water proof paper without the cost of of offset printing.

I would think that a laser printer would melt the plastic. Could you not use an ink jet?

kru

I meant ink jet, thanks.